Of all things .... asking to go to the hospital

I called awhile back when he jumped out of the car & walked off in a shopping center.

They said that wasn’t enough, but if people are wandering around in traffic or doing other stuff that puts them in harms way, they take it as “not capable of protecting himself” or something to that effect & they’ll do an involuntary.

There’s also something in there about self care. I don’t think taking a shower, changing clothes, etc. would count, but not eating for days does.

I’m sure it also depends on the person who’s doing the evaluation. I’ve read stories on here that sounded much more extreme than my son’s, and they wouldn’t do an involuntary.

We also live in Virginia where one of our high level state politicians Cree Deeds couldn’t get a bed for his son and it ended in tragedy, so maybe the thoughts on involuntary hospitalization has changed a little here? I think there’s still a shortage of beds though.

On the other hand, the fact that I’m getting him involuntarily held so easy could mean that he’s sicker than I thought. and my “new normal” has gone too far.

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I’ll have to reverse my little comment about not posting much, because I’d like some thoughts from anyone who’d care to chime in.

I’ve been talking to his case manager at the hospital. They put him on 10 mg of Trintillex in the morning (new antidepressant that by coincidence his pdoc put him on when he came out last time, but he stopped taking after 4/5 days) and 20 mg of Zyprexa dissolving at night so they could try to persuade him to take the Zyprexa injectible.

He’s been in there since Monday afternoon, so on meds now for 3 days not counting today.

The case manager called me today and put me on speaker with him in the room for a family meeting, and he’s asking why he’s in there and when can he leave, but he admitted that he can get paranoid and delusional. He also asked a ton of questions about how long they could keep people, what’s the longest she’s seen anyone stay, and whether or not people died there.

Earlier in the week, I questioned her about the Trintellix and how they thought adding an anti-depressant was going to help since the Zyprexa wasn’t fully effective last time, and after reminding me she wasn’t his psychiatrist, she said she thought that the dr was leaning towards a psychotic depression diagnosis - something he’s had in the past along with psychotic NOS, major mood disorder, etc.

She said that, in her opinion, the pervasive negative symptoms, how he talks, etc. wasn’t consistent with schizophrenia.

I’m wondering if he’s pulling it together in order to convince them to let him out? But, any thoughts on either the sudden insight or anything else?

On a positive note, he did call me last night to say he just wanted to tell me he loved me and that things would be better when he came home - calmer was the word he used. I explained that he didn’t do anything wrong, and that he wasn’t in there because things weren’t “calm” enough at home - I’m certainly hoping he doesn’t think this is punishment instead of help.

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I’m thinking about you and your son today. Hang in there.

SLW,

That’s weird because my son did that yesterday too. Sometimes I think they feel safe there and maybe they know they need help. I’m going to try and get mine to agree that we write to his psychiatrist to get him to sponsor a re-admittance so they can work on the meds in a more focused way. Otherwise, for our insurance company, I know we’ll go to the ER and do the 20 questions and nothing will happen result.

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He’s in a stand-alone mental hospital that has someone on staff 24 hours a day to do evaluations.

I think if they have an open bed and you wanted to admit yourself, they’d take you. I’m not 100% positive of it because both of his hospitalizations have been involuntary - even though he went in willingly for help. When he decides to leave, they decide he shouldn’t.

If you have something like that in your area, maybe it would be better than the ER.

Our ER has let me take my son home twice when they really shouldn’t have given either one of us a choice. The intake unit there is a scary place - you’re in a huge locked room that’s painted a bright, shiny white with no furniture other than one plastic chair and nothing else but a big camera pointing at you and a window with wire mesh in the door. Oh - and there’s a drain in the middle of the shiny, white-tiled floor. It was enough to make me feel a little crazy. And, the staff was very clinical.

In the hospital he goes to now, you go into a regular waiting room, you go through double doors that lock (but not so obvious), then the intake looks like a regular office - a desk, 2 to 3 comfortable chairs, a nice TV, they offer you drinks and snacks if you want them, then someone in regular street clothes talks to you about what’s going on. There is all the normal paperwork they fill out as they talk to you, but it’s really, really low key.

Since it’s a stand-alone facility, somehow they even get by with letting the patients go out for smoke breaks and that goes a long way to making the place tolerable for him.

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Yes, my son also has been a ‘frequent flyer’ at a stand-alone mental health hospital. Policies with the police have changed so that if they take him they HAVE to take him to the regular hospital ER, and the one time he went there, he was admitting feelings of self-harm, so he got admitted quickly. But since that change, they have supported me while I took him to the stand-alone location.

Little update.

I think I mentioned they put him back on Zyprexa along with Trintillex with the plans to use the Zyprexa injectible - even though I keep telling them that Zyprexa no longer seems to be fully effective.

I researched the Zyprexa injectible & find two things that means he won’t continue it.

  1. 2 people have died from overdoses after injections - the FDA has still cleared the drug, but he already believes that Zyprexa is very bad for you.
  2. Zyprexa is immediately effective when injected, but that also means you have to get the injectible at a clinical facility where they can monitor you for 3 hours for bad reactions/overdosing before they let you go home.

I called the mental health clinic where he’s getting outpatient treatment & not only will they not administer the Zyprexa shot, their doctors won’t prescribe it because they feel it’s too dangerous & there are too many side effects.

So, I guess we’re back to square one. I’m waiting on a call back to tell me what they’re planning, so it’ll either be
– full speed ahead on the Zyprexa shot & d*mn the consequences
– send him home on pills he’ll take for about 2 or 3 days then refuse
– start over on another med with pretty much a wasted week

I don’t know if they get it or not, but he’s no dummy. I’m thinking this may have been my one chance to get him on an injectible. Sooner or later, he’ll learn that no matter how desperate he feels, to not ask for help because it will mean an involuntary hold.

He’s already upset because he was ready to take the injectible today, they told him they had to find someone to do it (that was confusing to me until I started doing my own research), and have him thinking he won’t be released without a shot.

So sorry - that is MESSED UP.

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Not as messed up as I thought.

I finally got a call back & they had switched him to Invega over the weekend.
I think he must have misunderstood their explanation.

His cognition is low right now, and he has memory issues from a learning disability too. So, you have to give him information at the rate he can process it.

They were probably trying to explain why they switched the meds & his takeaway was that either they couldn’t find the meds or couldn’t find someone to administer, and he would not be released until he got the injection, so he would be staying indefinitely.

What they needed to make him understand was that they switched the meds because the Zyprexa injectible is a pain in the butt to keep taking, they were giving him something easier to get, that he needed to take the pill form for 5 days before getting the injection, and he would be released shortly thereafter.

And, maybe they tried - but you have to feed him information slowly when it’s something new and he’s stressed. Hopefully, the case manager will do a better job - or I will when he calls me again.

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Spoke to him on the phone & now he says they gave him a shot today.

He sounded calm - said he felt a little anxious, but no more than he’s been feeling in there.
Also said he felt a little sick and he sounded all stuffed up.

Hopefully, he hasn’t picked up anything nasty in there since it’s probably going into cold & flu season. I get a flu shot every year, but he won’t do it - and he’s not around enough people to build up his immunity with normal germ exposure.

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I think that is a move in the right direction.

I’m cautiously optimistic, but there were a few good things today.

They started Invega orally last weekend, gave him his first shot on Monday & will give him his second on Friday before he comes home.

  1. He has not said anything delusional on the phone to me all day today - at least 4 phone calls.
  2. His case manager had not seen him when she called me to line things up for the next 2 days, but when I asked her how he was doing, she said her colleague led one of his groups today - and she heard that he seemed clearer and he actually participated more than the minimal in the group. He participated in something that involved real, live, in-person people!
  3. He called me to make sure he was getting out on Friday & he didn’t misunderstand. He told me he was watching people play Spades & it looked like fun. He was agreeable about us both learning and playing at home. BUT he said something looked like FUN!!!
  4. Before he got off the phone, I heard someone who sounded like a nurse or a tech come in and ask him about something and when he talked to them, it sounded like a NORMAL conversation - I didn’t hear any nervousness or anything.

I know these are little tiny things, but little tiny things are all I have most of the time. I’m almost scared to hope the Invega will be what we’ve been waiting for, but he does deserve a break.

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That’s good, its progress!! I’m really happy to hear that for both you and him!! :smile:

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Progress is progress. I’m so happy for you both.

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In our world these are not so little things, they are meaningful and important. Try to enjoy the small victories, you and your son deserve the break and some happiness. I am so very glad that there has been a breakthrough with the Invega. My best to you. :slight_smile:

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Slw. - My daughter has said the same thing about wanting to go to the hospital. Unfortunately its not as easy at that in my state. I think our kids know when something doesn’t feel right and cry out for help by going to the hospital. I think Doctor has a point – is your son compliant with taking medication. I know my daughter will sometimes forget to to take medication or she blames everything on the meds and she’ll say I’m not mentally ill or she’ll say, “why do you want me to be mentally ill mom.”

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He was not compliant, and he wanted help, but would say he wasn’t sick and didn’t need medication at the same time. Sometimes, he’d say all he needed was for people to listen to him and give him a hug.

They’ve started the Invega shot for him this week, so we’re very hopeful.

Luckily, I think it is that easy here as long as you can find a bed. So far, both of his admissions have been involuntary, but it was his idea to go seek some kind of help each time. But, at the point he went, you could just look at him and tell things were very bad.

I’ve heard that too Molly. Also that I am the one who needs help because I want my son to have Scizophrenia is a common statement from my son.

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Those are not tiny things (in our world); they are huge:)

I hope he continues to feel better and become more engaged.

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I agree! That is what we all live for. Some good days when our loved ones are stable.

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