I think CBT and DBT are exactly the type of therapy they and perhaps we need to help them. I have a workbook because I couldn’t find a therapist for him that he related to and liked. We’re trying another one and I’m going to insist.
My 30 year old son stopped his meds in May. It has been hell ever since. He has been fired from his job. He has been violent towards us and sent to jail. He has many court dates now to attend. He drove his car without oil and blew the engine. He calls his dad and me and calls us terrible things and accuses us of sexual and physical abuse as a child. I am his rep payee for disability so he wants money every other day. He always says he is calling the police on me. He goes to court on Wednesday say I am hoping for some help but I am not going to get my hopes up. @Hope you are not alone.
What medications was he on before he quit, do you know?
Thank you Lmr. They made my son sign a paper agreeing that I would be his payee rep for his disability and his ssi. The person handling his case actually needed to see him in person to complete everything. I was afraid she would say something about him being mentally disabled and set him off. I was afraid in the waiting room that he would hear someone say something. He once made a scene in the theater when some people were actually whispering.
I hope you get some help, but I do understand you not getting your hopes up.
The last time my son tried to intimidate his dad we called for a CIT officer and got 6 armed sheriff’s deputies instead. Turns out our area just has one trained officer and he was on vacation. The time before the CIT officer had done a good job of talking to our son. That visit the officer explained to us the things he could arrest our son for and intimidating was one of them. So when we had one of the things happening the CIT officer had said was something he could arrest our son for we called.
Instead we got an all out response. The front of our house had 4 serious looking police vehicles. My son was so frightened of the six armed men with guns drawn wearing body armor, that he would not leave his apartment. I had to go out and meet them and they kept their guns drawn on me while they kept about 20 feet away from me. It was frightening. Two of the officers looked very young and they looked horribly frightened, which frightened me even more. I realized that they were afraid they were going to have to shoot me.
I did a lot of research afterwards and found out the reason they maintain that distance from me was because that’s the distance they are trained to maintain. The training tells them that distance gives them time to shoot me if I start to move toward them to hurt them. I never took a a step toward them -because I was terrified by the guns- BUT afterwards when i learned I wonder how many mentally ill and non-mentally ill people have violated that rule and been killed. Seems like everyone needs to know this rule.
After my son declined their request to come out, the officer in charge decided my son had not done anything to warrant them going in after him - ending that nightmare. Which he easily could have, they are also trained with something called ATM. Ask, Tell, Make. Luckily the officer stopped at Ask. I promised to the officer that I would address the issue of court ordered meds with our county judge.
The officer called me the next day and gave me his advice. He said he had been an officer for 25 years and had dealt with many mentally ill people. He advised against court ordered meds. He said it only creates a situation that escalates with each encounter putting everyone in danger. He said if our son ever actually did something we should arrange to have him picked up when our son is not at home.
Good luck Wednesday.
@Mom2 My son was on the pill form of invega. He is very anti-meds right now. He was on many different medications for about 3 years. We had 3 years of peace. My son was never the son I remember when on medication. He was always flat with no emotion. Nothing made him laugh anymore. But we didn’t have the violence and anger that we have now. The hatred he has for us parents is terrible. I just want my old son back.
They have plenty of cit officers where we live. We begged for them to help him but they arrested him and put him in jail. I guess we should of never told the truth about what happened. He threw me up against the kitchen counter and tried to throw his dad down the basement steps. This is because he wanted money because I am the rep payee,
We also had a swat team at our house about 8 years ago. We were in bed asleep and our son called 911 and told them to bring body bags. They told us to come out with our hands up. That was in the beginning of our son’s illness when we didn’t know what was going on with him. We just thought he was on drugs, which he was but that wasn’t his only problem.
My son called me tonight and told me that he will allow me to drive him to court on Wednesday because this is all my fault that he has to go to court and because it is cold and snowy here in Ohio, He also said I better have money for him. We are just praying they order some kind of help for him. .
There is a way to get a different rep payee through a mental health clinic; that also might get him into the clinic for treatment.
I also hope the court orders some treatment for him and that it helps.
My husband is afraid of our son. He has gotten better about understanding that its the illness. Just a little understanding on his part has made my life easier. Sometimes his concern about my son hurting him seems a little like paranoia. My husband gets too excited/overwrought when my son is psychotic. This does not help as he has made the situation worse at times.
The swat team experience was NOT a good time, my husband says we will never call for that sort of help again. Husband never left the inside of our house during the encounter, just watching them hold me at gun point ended his desire for their assistance.
Will you be okay in the car with him?
@hope, I certainly wouldn’t be envious of ME! Your son seems to be fairly stable, and he just made a good choice to try therapy - I hope something good comes from that. I don’t know how things would be if my son had had later onset - that HAS to complicate things. My son had a little college, but onset was late teens, so I think in a sense he didn’t get a chance to start adulthood, and we still had the dynamic that a kid and mom have. I think it would have been harder in your situation.
Your post made me stop and think “is he fairly stable?” I knew we had reached the coping stage, but stable?
Fairly stable yes, I guess he is, he’s not stomping around muttering outside his apartment - which is something.
I worry about him having a break at the therapy appointments. Usually he just calls people names and storms around as he leaves. We know its a progressive disease. I tried emailing the therapist anonymously, but she didn’t respond.
When I mentioned that he had purchased guns before to his first psychiatrist in a fax, the office person called me and told me “the doctor had not read my fax” and “I was not to send any more faxes that mentioned guns”.
I don’t always like it, but I try to take a pretty conciliatory approach whenever talking with service providers. I preface everything with expressions of appreciation, and say up front, I realize due to the privacy laws that you cannot tell me anything, but know I can communicate TO you with concerns or things that might help you understand the patient. And thank you for listening, and I know you have the patient’s best interests in mind, I respect the privacy, etc, etc. etc. And I always include my name, my relationship, and a way to be contacted. With guardianship it is easier, but some people still tend to fight against working as a team for the benefit of the patient.
I think I will be ok in the car with him. I haven’t had a problem driving him yet. My husband has had him try to jump out of the car before though.
He just called me and said he is walking. It is 10 miles one way for him. He said it is my fault that he has to go to court. All he said he wants from me is a check in his mailbox. In my victim’s statement to the court I asked to be taken off as payee. Hopefully they can do that.
Did you go to court? Did he make it to court? Did they address changing the payee? Thinking of you.
I’m very familiar with Dr. Amador and Anosognosia. My adult child has stayed away from me for years. Due to HIPPA, we as caregivers/parents etc. document, call, explain, but caregivers who may treat the SZ person cannot do much. The patient has all the rights. The only time I saw my child was 4 years ago hospitalized against their will into a County hospital. Unless you have a Judge or Attorney ready on-site to do a “conservatorship or guardianship” you have little to no chance. The hospitals in some States can enforce medication to be taken, but it’s 1 year at a time. Then you have to go through the whole process EACH and EVERY year (even for conservatorship). Some Counties in some States are enforcing Laura’s Law or back East (I believe it’s Kendra’s Law) wherein mentally ill who are seen on the street can be forced to take their meds within this Law. It’s not everywhere due to the fact that County by County, it takes them a lot of dollars out of their budget to enforce it.
Don’t give in to pressure from anyone. It is true, that if he were to be arrested and put (HOPEFULLY BUT NOT ABSOLUTELY) in front of a Mental Health Judge in the Jail System, they “might” make a 1 year court ordered mandate for taking meds.
All we can do is protect ourselves, our family members, and the affected mentally ill w/o getting hurt. Dr. Amador is amazing, but if your child (14 or 34) doesn’t recognize they have something behaviorally wrong…keep advocating and fighting the system, talk to our Congresspeople and State Senators. They’re the ones that can get something done.
Thank you. I really appreciate you taking the time to share your advice.
I drove the route I thought my son would walk and found him. At first he didn’t want to get in my car, but he reluctantly did. I dropped him off at the municipal court but he didn’t want me to go in. I went home but my husband was already inside. They didn’t do much because he has another court date on Feb. 22. My husband said they pretty much let him off of everything because of his mental state. I want them to do something. They need to order him to counseling or something. The probation officer told my husband that we needed to go to probate to get another rep payee. I went to the probate office with my son. They didn’t know what I was talking about. They acted like they did not know what a rep payee was. They told me to go talk to a lawyer. They gave me paperwork to get a conservatorship for him. I am going to call the probation department tomorrow and tell them what happened.
In the meantime, my son was very apologetic today and very grateful to us. He told us he loved us and thanked us. This is so nice when he is this way. I know better though that it will not last. I have been here before. Tomorrow he might hate me. We all know the drill. Thank you for listening and caring!
Sorry that you didn’t get much at all, but glad you had one of those nice moments with your son that pop up from time to time. Are you in the United States? I’m new here and haven’t figured out how to look at people’s profiles. Social Security handles the payee rep stuff in the States. Glad you got through the day, I kind of thought you would try to find him on his walk. Its the sort of thing we parents do
I live in Ohio. I have gone to social security many times. They say we have to find a new payee ourselves. They say they are too busy to find payees. My son really doesn’t have friends that could handle that. They all have mental illness themselves and would probably spend his money. I asked my brother but he said no. I asked social security to just take me off as payee but they said they would stop his benefits immediately if I did that. I was hoping if they took me off they would be forced to assign someone else. I guess it doesn’t work that way. I don’t want him to lose the money because he has his own apartment and I don’t want him back at my house. I have found a guy that has a business being a payee. It is $50 a month but we might have to go that route. Of course my son wants to handle his own money but I don’t think he would pay his rent or utilities.
There are charities that also provide rep payee services… http://www.colscss.org/senior-support/payee-services/
I just googled Ohio Representative Payee Services and found four in Central Ohio, but not sure where you are. There will most likely be a non-profit that provides, still with a fee, but at least it’s not you doing it.