Another awful weekend

[Jane57]

My son 25 on ( pailperidone depot ) he has no insight into his condition, expressed interest in going to a local college open day about marine courses on saturday. (he has a business studies degree)
Anyway he wanted to go to this, with a view to getting away and leaving the area, in his words to get away from mental health services. Ok so hubby went along with him, sat 2pm. Then he dropped off son at local football (soccer) match, they were texting during match as hubby at home wanted to know scores, and he was texting about another teams scores.

We really expected him home around the 5.30pm-6pm time.
No, all evening passed, never answered phone, texts etc, turned into night time, no sign of him.
I woke in the night several times expecting him to roll in at midnight or 2am or later.
Morning came and nothing. I tried several times to ring, text, no answer.

A police car pulled up outside our house, both my husband and I waited on the knock at the door, it was for a neighbour fortunately, but My thoughts were it was for him. (never been in trouble with police ever ) they only have been in our lives since the resisting of him going to hospital.

I finally made contact about 4pm with him, asked him where he was, he said he wasnt telling me that right now but he would be home in a few hours.
He rang (all on his terms) at 6pm asking if i could pick him up from somewhere about 2 miles away from our house, I was mad and said not a chance ! he made his way home.

He was not drunk looking , still quite tidy with hair still looking nice, clothes nice etc.
He was heavy breathing a bit and coughing, and pacing and kept saying aha out loud as he paced the floor, he looked quite distressed and quite flushed and kept saying that he was worried.

He said he had met guys went back and played on the nintendo and drank alcohol, random guys to random house, he didnt know, he has done a few things late like this, meeting up with strangers, etc
He said something to hubby he was worried about his bank, they logged in to online banking and son had made about 5 withdrawals from atm that night all for £100 each time (120 ish usd)
He said it was to buy alcohol and thats all he was saying, i asked did he keep going out the flat and using the atm then buying it, he clearly was lying and said yes,
I ask did he take any drugs (no history ever) he said no I’m not that silly.

He spends time with random strangers and yet wont give his grandparents-uncle etc his phone number despite spending christmas with them. Im in contact with them every day. They live 150 miles away.

He stank of cigarette smoke as did his clothes, he coughed all night, i mean all night, also blew his nose a lot, I worked out he had clearly been in contact with something, someone that he had a reaction to , he never had this cough the day before, it was odd.
Husband told him he had better tell him the truth today,

Im scared its come to this, in october last year he went out and stayed out for 2 nights, met a random stranger who stole his wallet and used his card and gave us so much worry and hassle as we had to change our locks as his key was in his wallet with his driver licence etc,

He also booked himself a holiday in 2015 the day before he was “sectioned” he was meant to go on it, paid 700 pounds and didnt go as he said something would happen on it, so he wasted a whole lot of money too then.

Its the lying we can’t stand, I can’t cope with a liar, I don’t know how to deal with this.
Today Im getting out the house, hubby will ring his nurse and I think we need to see a dr.
Does anyone get to a point like us and think they can’t or wont do it anymore,

He has no insight and even last night said he was silly and an idiot but he’s not ill.
Thanks for reading.

[Catherine]

Just a thought as I was reading your post…even though your son is obviously brilliant other than the lack of insight which is so common in sz…and even though he expressed interest in the college day etc…is it possible it is still just too much stress at this stage of his illness and part of his lack of insight is also not knowing exactly how much he can safely handle emotionally? Stress is the big enemy of recovery. as is the lack of insight…which is an actual condition in and of itself (anosognosia) --Just my two cents…so sorry for what you are experiencing right now… Anosognosia - Treatment Advocacy Center Cortisol: Why the "Stress Hormone” Is Public Enemy No. 1 | Psychology Today

[Jane57]

Thanks catherine, yes I think he is stressed, but what else can we do?
I am caring, don’t push him, suggest things for us to do he might like etc, He has changed, on fri he was really quite angry , suggesting his dad was never there for him, saying we shouldn’t have let them take his soul, saying he had no role model, its all blame blame blame for us, course its milder than before he was medicated when he said i poisoned his food, called my a cocaine bitch, psychotic bitch, not to mention the obscenities he came out with,
Then last night he was begging, (manipulating) gong on his knees saying have mercy on your boy, don’t make him leave HIS home, you can’t do this to your son…
I don’t know what to do anymore, my heart tells me one thing, my head says its bigger than us now and we can’t cope much more.

[Doctor]

How is it that he has money? Is he disabled? It’s clear that he cannot manage his money, so you may want to do something where you can act like his representative payee and whenever he wants to go out or do something, he has to tell you exactly what he wants to do and how much money he wants. And I know exactly what you mean with feeling like you just can’t go on anymore. They just don’t get it and how much it hurts to see them go through all of this whilst trying to help them and then for them to lie to us in the face and refuse any kind of help. My heart feels it’s being crushed by pressure all the time. It’s a constant state of anxiety where I can’t even go out with other people because I can’t leave him alone for one minute because I know he’ll do something moronic. I was in the hospital the other day for like 7 hours because of a kidney infection, I come back home like at 10:30 A.M. and I find wrappers of chocolate all over the bed and the microwave on the floor. It’s like I can’t even get a break.

[Jane57]

I’m so sorry Doctor, my heart goes out to you. How are you now?
I was at the stage last year thinking I won’t get respite till I’m dead.
My husband aid that to him today, he wants his money and he,lol give him it when he needs it.

We are in the uk, he gets a benefit every 2 weeks called employment support allowance for now anyway . He nevertheless claim any money for 18 months saying he didn’t have to (he wouldn’t give bank details ) for it to be paid anyway but in hospital they sorted this out for him.

He saves the money and has spent much in last 11 months (been out of hospital 6 months now.

[Doctor]

Thank you, I’m in a lot of pain. I’ve only been able to eat 7 hard-boiled eggs since Saturday. I’ve vomited everything else I’ve tried to eat so far. Oh, if he gets disability or goes into the hospital again, you can sign up to be his representative payee (in the U.S. a guardian or person to manage your money can be appointed if you are disabled).

[Jane57]

Ahh I see. Please try looking after yourself. Do you get help/respite at all?

[Doctor]

I mean, he tries to help me sometimes when he’s not being lazy.

[Catherine]

first of all I would recommend that you tell his psychiatrist all of what is happening here…the unabridged version, because it could be that the medicines need to be just very slightly altered or a different one added…I know this is probably the last thing you want to do…but his behavior is beyond his control with this illness…in the early years with my son, the countless times he cursed me or shoved me or stole from me or ran away from me or broke things, and lied…and my son use to be a drug user also…I mean the incidents were endless…I often thought I could not do it anymore and that one of us was absolutely not going to make it another day…when the behavior is erratic I go to two things, first I try to make everything quiet and peaceful and 2nd I ask nothing of my son, not even suggestions (just for awhile) just let him be, reassure him, you love him and you are glad he is there with you (even if you really aren’t for many reasons) I know you love him to pieces but regardless of his abilities and skills that he possesses…it will take a long while for him to reinvent himself, and he will —but it may not be anywhere close to what he originally wanted to do with his life, it may seem like he is doing nothing of value with his life but think of it like this: if being quiet and doing very little gives his brain peace and allows for him to be saner then isn’t that the more important thing? In addition I would still talk to the doctor and get his or her input on it…when your son criticizes you or your husband…please don’t take it personally, I have learned not to do that with my son and often when he is thinking more clear he never remembers the awful things he has said. If he spouts of something now, I say, “I am sorry you feel that way, what would you like me to do about that?” That usually stops him because he doesn’t REALLY mean what he said he just said it…and he might answer something kooky back to me or say, “whatever” and walk away…what I have learned more than anything is I get a LOT farther when I react far less emotionally and even inject humor (in a normally humorless situation) anyway everyone’s different I hope you can stick it out with your son because I believe it will get better…My heart goes out to you and just know I understand.

[Hereandhere]

The weekend sounds awful.

A few years ago, we got to the point where family member was kicked out of house for months.

At the time, I felt our family had to do what we did. We’re human. We have our limits. We have our own physical bodies to care for that can only endure so much stress.

I was wrong to kick family member out, but am speaking only for our family. I know sometimes people really have to do this and it’s sometimes for the best.

[slw]

I’m not a Dr Phil fan, but he was on a different talk show (not a fan of that one either, but it was on the TV & he was talking about the 'cash you outside, how ‘bout dat’ girl who for some reason I can’t figure out makes me laugh, at her, certainly not with her), but he also showed a clip about a different girl who was clearly delusional & shared some of the same types of delusions my son has.

One was that Dr Phil was her uncle. And, she was so delusional that even when he asked her directly if she thought he was her uncle, she said yeah, she thought so.

Long story short, her family was thinking she was a pathological liar, but Dr Phil said she was clearly delusional and needed serious help - and that no one could love her back to health…

I don’t get too many good takeaways from Dr Phil, but that’s a good one - you can’t love them back to health.

I think we all try to do that, and at some point, maybe we need to step back and let someone more qualified help. I’m rolling that around in my mind and trying to decide where that line is.

I’m kind of thinking it’s like little kids. My mom ran a home daycare for a few years and I remember she had a few kids who were horrible for their parents. In one case, the mother could barely pick the little boy up by herself. He’d kick her & all kinds of things. For my mother, he was so good that sometimes she’d just pack him up and take him with her when she went on vacation. And, it’s not that my mom was a pushover, she knew how to be very firm when they needed it, and kind when they were being good.

Maybe, sometimes, our grown children need that too, and it’s almost impossible for us as parents to be that person - there’s just too much history in some cases.

Just kind thinking about the whole thing right now myself. I’m not ready to send my son to a group home, but I am ready to take a step back and let this new intensive program he’ll start soon take over a few things. At least, today I am. Tomorrow, he might be my baby again & I’ll go back to my old overprotective self.

[Jane57]

Found out last night he had blew the money and treated the random strangers he met buying drugs, he has never done it before.
Im taking some time out for me right now, Im disgusted at him, told him I hate him, he will go and spend the night doing that and not even call or text us, not even give the people who care for him his number and gave it to one of the guys he literally met on saturday , he sent my son a text saying "hi its @@@@@@@ thanks for a great night…

I didnt cope well last night, I lost it with him, yes I know not good for his stress, not good for his recovery but what he is doing and the choices he is making are even worse for his recovery,
He has been offered, group outings, peer support, football games to play, etc and does nothing then does this.

Im in shock to be honest, naive I might be, but never had any dealings with drugs, oh aint I lucky some might say but thats the truth and he said its his first time trying it too. Actually I think it is. Apparently he has been saying for a few months to his gran, my mum, why do people take drugs ? and should he take drugs?? imagine that.

[Doctor]

I know how you’re feeling. Even at the slightest mention of drugs or his experiences in the past, I can’t help but feel disgusted and disappointed at my fiancé for doing such foolish things.

[Jane57]

Thank you , I feel with what everyone else goes thorough and their families on this site that Im coming across as selfish, I know he is ill, they are ill, but we have feelings too.
Ive tried and tried and tried with him and this for us is a big big shock.

He doesnt believe mental health team are beneficial and think they have ulterior motives then goes and does this . Yes I know he is ill.

[Doctor]

Yeah, they sometimes just don’t get that. They forget that we feel and have needs as well. My fiancé believes the same thing about anyone in the medical or political profession. He asked me to look up Trump’s address today to send him a sentence in a letter, but I told him I wouldn’t waste stamps on that. When he was committed for a long time, he would get up on tables and give speeches or write them. He was going to say it to the judge, but I told him not to because it would only give him more time in there (he already had 3 months).

[slw]

I’ll play devil’s advocate for a second, because I’m always trying to put myself in my son’s shoes.

Perhaps, it felt good to be out doing things that he thinks people his age are doing, with people who may have accepted him and not thought much about whether he was mentally ill or not?

Whether these people would have been as accepting of him if he hadn’t been footing the bill for their party is up for debate, but my cousin’s friends are pretty much into staying up all night playing video games and sometimes drugs are involved (mostly marijuana, but other things sneak in. drinking sometimes, but it’s not the norm.) - they’re pretty much the stereotypical stoners. I don’t agree with their lifestyle choices, but they are the nicest , least judgemental group of guys I’ve ever met.

My cousin is working out of state right now, but this group would have accepted my son without question - I have no doubt about that. However, I could never send hm over there for a night of hanging out because of the drug use. What doesn’t seem to hurt them all that much could be devastating to someone with a severe mental illness.

Anyway, that’s kind of my take on why he may have acted that way, and my approach would be more about finding out why he did something and talking to him about whether or not those people took advantage of him.

I would also find out who they were if possible & then decide if having a talk with them about my son’s issues and what their kind of fun could mean for him would accomplish if he continues any kind of relationship. Depending on what kind of people they are, they could turn into actual friends and advocates for him. He might listen to them better than you when it comes to treatment, and they might be more understanding than you think.

My reasons for that kind of thought is that if I can’t prevent something like him hanging out with questionable people, I should try to find a way to take advantage of it.

[Vallpen]

Don’t beat yourself up. You are under stress too, and the person in this situation who never loses their patience must be from another planet.

[jmarie1067]

@slw

…you can’t love them back to health.

I think we all try to do that, and at some point, maybe we need to step back and let someone more qualified help. I’m rolling that around in my mind and trying to decide where that line is.

This is such great advice. I do believe this illness requires distance from the unconditional love that often exists between us and our loved ones to gain a more proper perspective at times. I am sorry for your experience @Jane57 this weekend, and with my son just entering an involuntary hospitalization last night, it reminds me of how important it is to regroup in times of turmoil

In my life with my son, I have chosen to come along side him in this marathon, and although the definition of “coming along side” is always changing, I am learning I cannot completely rescue him from himself. There is not a treatment or cure that will create an end in this marathon we are both running. I am learning that coming along side him may only mean that I am part of his team, as I cannot possibly endure running it next to him.

As my son’s illness advances, one of the hardest realities for me is trying to get clear on what I am equipped to do, as well as what may be best for me to do…and discovering that it is not the same as what I am willing or able to do. Then it is finding comfort in knowing that I am doing the best I can with what is available to me to make loving, deliberate, and well thought out decisions…to essentially forgiving myself for the train wreck I cannot predict.

Wishing you all the best in the next steps of your journey with your son.

[Hereandhere]

Illicit drugs are truly horrible and even worse for our family members with sz.

50% of people with severe mental illness have problems with substance use. So, that’s part of our collective reality unless we luck out.

I want to honor your feelings of disappointment and anger. I also see that you are able to prise apart your hatred of your son’s actions and your love for him. The anger is real. Your feelings are completely valid.

For our family members, I think most of us can pretty easily get to the place where we understand why they try things that lots of young people try. But these common experiments go way worse for our family members and it’s terrifying to know how negatively these types of choices affect them.

I think it’s really good you’re taking time for yourself. As you withdraw from a very difficult situation, I hope you find your own safe place with comfort and stability.

[Jane57]

I spoke yesterday to his cpn (Community psychiatric nurse) She rang back today after talking to the dr, who said its not the psychosis that make him do the things he did at weekend. I ask my son why he did that, he replied not for the fun but to see if it would make me be able to read minds…

New one now, he is saying his dad (my hubby) told him he is a paedophile, now this is dangerous ground, I did challenge that I’m afraid and he said hubby said it in a “non sensical sentence” thats the word son used. He said hubby said blah blah blah la ala, I’m a ******** . this is quite dangerous as if he ever uttered stuff like that outside it could have all sorts of consequences we never know.

He is back to being horrible to me today, saying I should have changed doctor when he was a kid as it was the doctor intention to set him apart, he said he will end up being gang ***** by a bunch of men. Said the dr in the hospital is a terrorist and he wants to recruit my son and take him to afghanastan to traffic him. I know a lot of this could be down to the cocaine at the weekend, but yes am worn down now.
Nurse is coming out friday x