Family and Caregiver Schizophrenia Discussion Forum

Can a schizophrenic be reasoned with?


#1

can a schizophrenic be reasoned with? my friend has some off the wall beliefs on religion and her roll in it. is there any hope of convincing her the voices aren’t always right?


#2

in my experience, not until everything blows up in their face. then they will question what the hell happened


#3

I was afraid of that, thank you.


#4

ya sorry about being the bearer of bad news there,

my beliefs were so fixed at the time, there was no way of anyone convincing me what was going on was not real.

i think one way of knowing how fixed they are in the belief is how defensive they will be towards you if you question them


#5

its ok, I have questioned her a few times and offered other scenarios or explanations and she will consider them but on some subjects she becomes immediately defensive


#6

**Its true-if they want to argue the point consistently, you really cant convince them otherwise. **


#7

Can you say what they are specifically? Without knowing at least some details it would be hard to say if it’s an actual part of the religion itself, or its extremism or grandiosity.

For instance, I believe Jesus Christ is Lord…It’s a core belief of Christianity…though some people think it’s delusional. However, if I start going around saying I am the mighty prophet of God sent to save the world or I am Jesus himself, then people need to start to worry.


#8

Yes they can.

For instance, if a schizophrenic keeps saying over and over and over and over that he or she has found the cure to cancer by a stroke of luck, no reasoning will come forth between this person and any other human being spoken to. No one will even bother to listen.

However, if one doctor just one time says that he or she has found the cure to cancer by a stroke of luck, reasoning will come forth between this person and any other human being spoken to.

However, if the entire Earth is at threat to some new global disease, and the doctors of the world are dumbfounded when still not knowing how to find a cure only weeks before the entire global population is about to die, but a schizophrenic keeps saying over and over and over and over that he or she has found the cure by a stroke of luck, full reasoning will come forth between this person and every other human being spoken to. For some inexplicable reason, people will listen.


#9

If she’s not already aware that her mental state is off balance the prolly not.

I think its chemical reaction in the brain that causes these delusions because I know that im way off balance mentally but my belief in my delusion being a delusion falters almost daily.

The feeling of conviction is so great that im once again in that loop where im thinking “is it real? Am I really some kind of angel?” Even though 3 hours ago I was sure it wasn’t real.

Its been proven that adrenaline is a chemical that flood the brain and causes a person to feel different I think sz delusions are the same way.

How I convince myself it not real is I find posts of people with sz that have the same delusions I do and they reassure me that its just an sz delusion because others have the delusions.

Do a search on delusions here and find some that are similar to hers and show them to her.


#10

Hallucinations, RELIGIOUS OR NOT, often lead to arguments and misunderstandings.

Cases of non-shared hallucinations, do raise a flag.
Cases of shared hallucinations, do NOT raise a flag.

For instance… People see cars stop, move, move faster, slow down, and stop again. However, a simple analysis of “motion”, via the use of nothing but the mind, soon leads you to seeing the fact that all cars are constantly in motion, and that they never stop moving. This constant motion applies to all objects. All that can be done is change the direction of this constant motion as it is constantly on the go within a 4 dimensional structure known as Space-Time.

This simple ABC analysis of motion soon has you independently understanding Special Relativity, and it also has you independently, and successfully, creating all of the Special Relativity equations with absolute ease.

(To watch this easy breezy analysis of motion in action, goto youtube videos 1-9 at http://goo.gl/fz4R0I )

Thus, those who see objects, such as cars, speed up and slow down etc., are those whom are obviously “Seeing something that isn’t really there.”, it isn’t really happening at all. They are experiencing an hallucination.

But since this hallucination is being shared globally, it is considered to be normal, thus no arguments arise, thus no reasoning is seen to be needed.


#11

Sometimes you just have to smile, shake your head, and walk away.


#12

@e_lunaseer at first she believed she was gods daughter, now she thinks she is his wife and its her job to lead the believers back to the holy land. (Israel) she has moved two homeless men with mental problems of their own into her house saying God directed her to as they are to go to Israel with her to protect her.


#13

That is so screwed up dude.

Its situations like that that should be avoided at all costs.

They are total strangers?


#14

Yeah classic case religious delusions. She needs help!


#15

@petester for the most part yes, she met them once or twice at the VA. Hospital.


#16

That doesn’t sound safe at all I hope she’s ok.


#17

I’ve found talking about my sword delusions just whipped them up.
Best to talk about healthy happy things.
Leave symptoms to the professionals.


#18

I think they can occasionally. I wouldn’t just give up on it.


#19

Try few times if you want to but don’t expect that you would be understood. Your reason may not be valid according to the person in any delusion so always be prepared of some harsh and sharp words at the end. As others said things get better with time. As time passes and the person realises how irrational the thoughts were, he would be less resistant and more tolerant towards you. Just show patience and please don’t get angry at the person. Just try to understand that what is unreal to you is real to the person. He/she is helpless as you are when seeing what she/he wants to show you.
Please be supportive in any situation. Keep reminding about taking medicines regularly every now and then…


#20

Oh my, yeah that’s a bit grandiose I would say.
Ok, so your reasoning could be from scripture then since it appears christian and bible based.

We are ALL sons and daughters of God… 2 Corinthians 6;18 > “And I shall be a Father to you, and you will be sons and daughters to me, says THE LORD, The Almighty.”

The Church , meaning all believers in the world who truly believe are called the Bride of Christ… there is no special specific wife, and even the church reference is in a symbolic sense.

*Let us be glad and rejoice, and give honour to him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath made herself ready.
And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
… And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb’s wife. And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God ~ Revelation 19:7, 21:2,9, 10

The new Jerusalem is a spiritual concept, not physical Israel, and while the Jews were predicted to return to Israel that already happened in the 1940s.

Sounds like she is seriously twisting scripture and probably some demonic influence there too… It’s grandiose.

While i do believe some people are called to do things like missionary work, helping people, etc, this does not sound like that…especially with the Gods wife part …