My son just left Home after 5 months of Hospital and Rehabiliation

@Mom2 So glad you are safe and so sorry at the same time. Breathe in and breathe out. Yes, being able to take your own advice is as important as knowing the advice to give isn’t it?

Mine texted he was having a panic attack the other night and asked if I would take him to the ER. I have asked him if he was having a panic attack many times during episodes hoping that some day he would take me up on it. Well he finally did, and my phone was on do not disturb so I didn’t see the texts until morning. Deep sigh here.

Several weeks ago his dad had said I had to have a break at night from the accusing hysterical texts. I let Jeb know that to reach me if he needed anything at night he would have to call - do not disturb on iPhones will let calls from “favorites” come through. I knew the odds on Jeb remembering when he was upset weren’t very good. But, hey, my husband really appreciated me listening to him - so I learned something. Its good for our relationship if I can let my husband have input to the “handling of Jeb” plan.

All we can do is try to have a happy holiday season around our - trying to put this into a visual - we all have the presence of scz in our lives - I don’t want to see it as a dark cloud circling us shooting off random thunder, lightning and rain - that seems too dark for the holidays and I don’t want to think of my son as a dark cloud. I am comfortable seeing Jeb’s illness as a glowing sphere -maybe a holiday ornament (?) in our lives that we have to dodge around.

Other families have to have their holiday around drunken family members and all sorts of family chaos - our holiday challenge is just a lot bigger than getting someone to take drunk auntie home.

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Hope, thank you for the reminder. I am going to my share this with my husband. Thank you again for your kind words and support. It means the world to me.

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I am still not sure if I should travel. Where can I find him. He is released from jail today and back to streets. he has a court date the day after Xmas 12/26 and i know he will not appear at his court date. If I go, I may be able to talk to the judge about need for involuntarily commitment but according to self help on Santa Clara Website mental health, a Psychiatrist needs to establish that he is gravely disabled in order to get treatment. Both Public defender cannot request and I cann’t request involuntarily treatment in California. Only the Psychiatrist needs to make recommendation to the court order for my son to get treatment and to be conserved.
Right now, my son is victim of the criminal court justice in California. he does something in public, they take him into custody and keep him for 2 days then discharge him back to streets without any help. God, how is he suppose to get better.

I spoke to a private lawyer and he indicated that he cannot do anything and he thinks I should let the court deal with the process.

I just spoke also to the police and he said that when he is in Custody, it is treated for his mental illness only if he is found to be a danger to himself or others, otherwise they will let him go. He said it is not a crime to be homeless on the street. he also recommend that I will add my brother to the Guardianship since my brother is over there in California but this process is costly and long. I already paid $3000+ to get the guardianship here in my State.
I am asking myself now, why did I let him go back to California. I should had tried so hard to keep him here and forget about him appearing in Court in California for a violation he did back in 2016.
Now, he is getting sicker every day and he on streets and God only knows what will happens to him and if he even survive.

Keep me in your prayers… I am feeling hopeless and not sure what to do.

I will file a missing person police report. this is my only option now.

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The 4th Amendment of the Constitution is what gets in our way when we want to help our children have court ordered meds in the United States, “unreasonable search and seizure” is not allowed.

The 5th amendment assures that we “can’t be deprived of life, liberty or property without due process of law”

With a friendly nod to our British friends on the forum - love you guys- most of our early laws (Bill of Rights, Constitution) were aimed at shaking British laws off of our Colonial Americans.

In the 60’s civil rights attorneys made sure these laws were applied to include those with mental illness.

There really isn’t an exception made for our loved ones being unable to recognize they are ill. While the various states are working to change laws to help us get our loved ones on meds, the reality is, for the most part, everyone’s hands are tied. The strings that tie everyone’s hands are the basic beliefs that built the United States. Sigh.

Words like “informed consent” came along a lot later, probably from the medical world. We learned all about informed consent when my husband donated a kidney to our older son, even more about the subject 7 years later when I donated a kidney to Jeb. (you have to sign a lot of dire warnings)

You would think that having a guardianship from your state which has declared your son incapable, would be enough to get them to hold him for your arrival and the court date. Guardianship can only do so much, it can’t force them to take meds and at its best its a voice for you in the state that issues it. Even with guardianship its a struggle to get medical personnel to listen. My husband was granted full guardianship for both of his parents. Before his Mom’s hip surgery when he was explaining that he had to sign the permission for surgery documentation, a nurse told him “if only you had power of attorney” - when we told her the guardianship was more powerful - the nurse disagreed.

So we sit @CAAR2016, hands tied, hoping for the best, helpless to do more. I am sorry.

Prayers, yes.

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in my State, I was able to take his civil rights away for a short period and my lawyer helped me to admit him for 5 weeks to County hospital in 2015 and he got better.

Again, in Texas by end of Janurary, I was able to hospitalize him for one month and 3 weeks and get better on Invega Shot and depokat.
his major issue is medicine Compliance.
Now, he is in California and my hands are tied.
I just poke to another private lawyer assistant and she echoed the same as the private lawyer I spoke to couple days ago.
A person must be in a hospital first under 72 hours hold then 7 days then 14 days hold. If the MI person is hospitalized for 30 days or more, then the psychiatric doctor can make referral to the office of public Guardian then he can be conserved temporary.
Permanent conservatorship may be possible only in severe cases.
As long as my son is not found dangerous to himself or to another, he will not be taking to Hospital.

he was hospitalized in another county for at least 4 times in the past 5 months just by disturbing the peace.
I think in California, things can change from County to county, Law enforcement agency handles thinks different.

I am also thinking out loud that even if they hold my son until my arrival to California, What guarantee do I have if he will travel with me. last time, I was in California toward end of August and he was also homeless at that time, he escaped as soon as he saw me.

I am hoping that he can get into an Outreach program to get food voucher and housing and some medical care and of course I am praying for his safety.

my best bet in future is to find work close to his location and keep monitoring him.

I can retire in another year, then I am thinking that I will need to move to California

I will Keep praying about my situation and about his safety…

@Hope, how do you feel living with one kidney?
So Jeb is not taking any medicine right now! praying for him

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@CAAR2016 Life for me with one kidney is pretty much the same. It doesn’t affect my activities, I’m just supposed to avoid Aleve and some other meds that can be hard on kidneys. Aleve was the one that was difficult for me. I took Aleve daily for running injuries.

Yes, Jeb is still unmedicated. He took one day of meds this year and complained of side effects. Thanks for the prayers, sometimes its all we can do.

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Glad your are OK with one kidney.
my Mother also lived with one kidney until the age of 92.
How does the Jeb spend his time? I want to learn his thought process so I can understand what my son would be doing now on streets!
missing him during this holiday season. I saw him in my dreams last night and I had happy moments with him. it was a beautiful time during the dream. I did not want to wake up then my alarm buzzed and back to my Reality!

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I’m so sorry your son is in another state. I think you are wise to wait and not spend your energies trying to get out there with no guarantee and indeed all likelihood that he will flee once again. Hang in there and I’ll be praying that things improve. Big hugs

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I agree with @Mom2. Keep up the search from afar and go when you know where he is???

Did your mom lose a kidney?

When he is having good days, Jeb does online video games and plays his guitar.

I think they all spend a lot of time thinking about their delusions.

I have seen Jeb in dreams where he is like he was before scz. Those are my favorite dreams. Just in the past year has Jeb shown up as ill in some of my dreams.

I think you are right that the odds aren’t very good he would travel home with you.

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I remembered I had this quote and wanted to add it to this thread.

"The opposition to involuntary commitment and treatment betrays a profound misunderstanding of the principle of civil liberties. Medication can free victims from their illness - free them from the Bastille of their psychosis - and restore their dignity, their free will and the meaningful exercise of their liberties.

Herschel Hardin 1993

Everyone won’t agree with all of his personal politics, but like many of us, he had a son with scz.

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Thanks. Sergeant Abbey Serrano and other police enforcement are helping to locate him.
His probation officer issue a warrant to get him in custody as soon as police finds him

I just mailed a packet of information to DA office and Public defender office and to the judge in Santa Clara county that include FORM AB2414 that list of crisis he has been through since 2015.

hopefully they will find soon.

Keep praying for his safety…

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Thanks @Hereandhere and @Mom2 and @Hope for all your advice.

Keep prayers going for his safety.

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Hope, thanks for sharing a great quote.

My Mom had a non cancer tumor in one of her kidney. it was removed at the age of 70 and she lived with 22 years with one kidney. she died of heart failure at the age of 92.
I enjoyed the dream the other day. I saw my son who came back home and he looked clean and asked him how he got the money to come back and he said I have saved it from the money you gave to Jaime( Family friend).

when he is sick, he curses me a lot and says things like: he hates my voice!!

when he is better and on medicine, he would say: Mon, it is a treat to be with you at your home and I wish I can be successful like you. you own 2 properties and a good job, etc…

what an evil Illness !!

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Caar2016, it is heart wrenching. I am praying for you both. Great idea on sending the packet. God bless you.

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Yes, sending prayers to you and your son

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Called Police and ask what to do. he gave the telephone for several hospitals in the area. after calling several of the, I found him in one county hospital. I was directed from ER to Admission to another operator to 2 different Psychiatric Pavilion and finally reach out to the nurse in his unit. the nurse did not want to confirm or deny that he is there according to Privacy act/HIPAA in California. Finally, they gave the patient telephone. I called and he answered. What a gift during XMAS. Thanks God for hearing his voice and that he alive. He was having dinner and he did not want to talk.
I called him again and asked him to go back to the city where my brother & family friend is? then he started saying that he does not like anyone of them. I asked him to come back to my home and he said that he does not want either and that I am controlling him. he said he wanted to live in Richmond, VA where I bought him the condo during College years. I explained to him that the Condo is under lease for another 6 months but he did want to accept it. he wants me to evict the tenant so he can move in.
I know he is sick and it will take time for him to get better. I am not even sure if he is taking medicine in the county Hospital.

I told him that I cannot let him to live alone, he started cursing and telling abusing languages… I hung up the phone in
I know that he will be released in few days back to streets and then what??

My brother consulted with LPS Conservator lawyer in California and she said that she can help us to become his conservators ( I and my Brother) and we would be responsible for providing him a place to stay and basis food and other necessities… but we still cannot lock him up in a facility and he can still be free to leave the home and panhandler on streets if he chooses to do so.

**Also, she said that she would not be able to start the process unless he is living in a stable place… **
But this is the issue that we need to force him to stay in a safe place since he is so sick now and refusing to deal with my brother or family friend and to come back to my home.

She said also we can start by contacting the public guardian office in Santa Clara and consult with them.
but I know from another lawyer and from one the Public Guardian office that the public guardian office cannot do anything unless there is a doctor recommendation for my son to be assigned to public Guardian and this usually happens after 30 days of hospitalization.

Does anyone knows if a family Conservator in California can force medicine on Conservatee and if he can request the police to take him to hospital if he is non-compliant on medicine even if he not dangerous to himself or others…

Or another question: What are rights does the conservator has on a Conservatee in California?

I want to know what can I do now.
He is in hospital and not listening to me and does not want to deal with my brother or Family friend in California and will be released in few days back to streets…

Thanks God that he is found and I am praying so hard to lead me to next step in the right direction so I can get my son off the streets… and he can start listening to me and to his uncle.

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You have done so much CAAR2016.

So glad you got to hear his voice, I can understand how it is a Christmas gift for you.

I am sorry that guardianships and conservators don’t give us the ability to help our loved ones very much. It does sound as though the Conservator lawyer your brother contacted has said you cannot force him to be locked up in a facility.

So many of us end up in the hopeless circles with no way to get help for our loved ones.

More prayers for you to have the strength to be his mom.

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I’m so glad you heard your son’s voice and so sorry he yelled at you.

I hope you find a path forward that helps him and you.

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